Continental 244/Chrysler 251 Flatheads as replacments for th

[Orangeman]

I was thinking about posting this as a reply to DHuffmans post but after a bit of thought this post turns out to be more of a question than a reply to his post.  Can someone please set the record straight on the commonality between the Continental F244 blocks and the Chrysler Industrial 251 flatheads.  The older gentlemen in my area of the country claim that the engines are essentially the same.  Did Continental produce the engine for Chrysler? This would seem somewhat unlikely since Chrysler built there own engines, but on the other hand it may have been cheaper from an engineering standpoint to purchase directly from Continental.  One last thought the 251 chrysler flathead uses exactly the same 3.438 bore as the continental F244 flathead. John S. or Blake can you help.  Answers to this question may help guys considering replacement engines or spare parts if they have an engine thats getting a little tired and could get a good replacement.  Thanks Guys .... Orangeman

[John Schwiebert]

The F-244 could replace a 226. A 227 and a 245 will also replace a Continental 226. The 227 & 245 use a flanged thrust bearing the 226 & 244 do not. Many other parts interchange. Some that do not are the heads, cranks bearings and head gaskets. The Chrysler while similar since it is a L-head six cylinder will not interchange. For your information some 3.250 bore Chrysler pistons will also work in an Oliver 70 with an 1/8 overbore. The Oliver was built by Continental. Some Ford and Chevie piston ring sets are the same too. Why, they are the same bore and use the same width rings. It pays to have dimension books on hand when doing this stuff. Hope that helps, if not ask away. By the way Cletrac offered a 226 Continetal as a replacement for the 226 Hercules after World War two. John

[Blake Malkamaki]

John, off the original subject a little, but here's a question... How does the length of an F-226 compare to a OOC Hercules? Will there be fan clearance problems if an F-226 were put in an AG or H?

I always thought the Oliver wheel tractor engines were built by Waukesha.

Thanks,
Blake

[Blake Malkamaki]

Sorry John, I meant to say AG or E. Not H.

[John Schwiebert]

Blake I have even read some Cletrac literature about the replacement for the OOC being the Continental 226. The Oliver 70 is the only overhead valve Continental they ever used and it might have been Continental's first attempt at an overhead valve engine. Some of the 70 parts interchange with F-226 parts.

[Orangeman]

John S. Thanks Very Much for your response.  Also, you mentioned that I should ask away, so here's another question for you.  The 244 in my dynahoe has a vickers pump connected to the crank, (i.e. the crank extends past the cover and couples to the hydraulic pump.  I would like to use a known good 226 continental block as a temporary replacement while the 244 is out for an overhaul.  Heres the problem the 226 has a closed cover in front of the crank and cam gears and the crank in it does not extend through like my 244 does.  Is there a special assembly that allows connecting the crank in a standard power unit to the hydraulic pump or were engines designed with longer cranks through the cover to allow coupling a hydraulic pump?. Hope I have explained this question adequately! Thanks Guys! Orangeman  

[John Schwiebert]

No doubdt you have a 226. Now I need to figgure out if you have a funky forklift engine or a boat motor. Both Hercules & Continental made some marine engines and some them drive off the back and nothing out the front. Also some are left hand rotation. A good friend of mine has been a Continental dealer since a little after World War 2. I wish I knew what he forgot. See if you can find some kind of I. D> tag on it. Now you know why there are so many different gaskets used for those engines. Send me a U2U with a phone number I will be working all week , but will be home every night this week. Hope this is food for thought. John

[John D]

Orangeman,
Here's a photo of the front of my F226 - it's actually a Willys Super Hurricane engine.  See the four holes around the center of the crank pulley?  There's a mating piece that fits into that, with a coupling to the front hydraulic pump.  I have the same set up in my Ford 8N tractor, and the pieces are available from Ford.   I imagine other tractor dealers would carry them too - a pretty standard PTO linkage item.  
If the photo doesn't attach, try this link and look at the third photo.
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze1ykcw/id11.html

[Orangeman]

Well Guys:  Here's some more follow up on the venerable Continental Flatheads. I finally took the head of mine and the bores are worn at the top.  Two schools of thought prevail regarding the rebuild of a continental ... one is to sleeve the 244 back with sleeves and install 226 pistons, expensive.

The second is to overbore and true up the cylinder and install oversized pistions.  The Continental Engine people have advised that early 244's can be bored up to .080 over without cracking and porosity problems.  Early 244 are the 50 and 60's time period prior to the Continental's Engine Consolidation program, which replaced the 244 with a 245 nomeclature.  I was advised that the later 245 blocks have the cylinder walls siamesed and therefore are not recommended as candidates for reboring.  Anyone have experience on this matter or advise to lend regarding overboring of the older 244 continental's.  Any help or thoughts on this subject are very much appreciated!  Orangeman :

[John Schwiebert]

Is it standard now and will it cleanup at 30 or 40? That is correct on the 245. I have an AERA Bulletin to that affect.

[Orangeman]

Hi John: Very good thoughts indeed!  I am thinking that it is standard and has never been rebored.  The machine was involved in a fire and the 244 that is in the machine is a service engine.  I will know for certain when I remove the block.  By the way, what does AERA stand for... and could I convince you to photo copy the bulletion in exchange for some cash and postage?  

Please let me know when you get a chance.  Thanks very much for your input on the subject.  I hope with the exchange of information here that it can possibly help someone else in the future.  Orangeman!:)

[John Schwiebert]

I will try to get with you over the weekend. This is the busy fall farming season here.